Post by ARCHIVE on Jun 6, 2006 12:37:31 GMT
From: FingersLily (Original Message)
Hi Everyone,
I think this is an excellent website, very well-designed & laid out.
I was delighted, also, to see my name on the 'About' page. I do feel partly responsible for this, seeing as I was involved in the original discussions years ago on the Guardian website.
I do, however, have to point out that this website displays incorrect results. If you look back at my contribution all those years ago, you will see that I did not include the South Korea 1-0 Colombia match on 31/01/95.
I did some extensive research when compiling my list and I am in no doubt whatsoever that this was not an official match. It was more of an exhibition game with South Korea fielding a sort of Under 21 side (although it wasn't even officially that team).
The South Korean FA do not recognise it as an International & neither do FIFA. Consequently, no appearance/goal stats for this game exist. If you do not accept this, please take a look at the South Korean FA website for confirmation. If this game is included, we should also have testimonials, warm-up games & exhibition matches which would make a huge difference to the outcome.
As it turns out, excluding this match does not make a huge difference to the overall results list. I have attached a file showing the route that should be followed, starting with the match PRIOR to the unofficial game and ending with the 1998 World Cup match between Brazil & Holland, where the incorrect trail is re-joined.
Obviously, excluding this match will have an effect on the All-Time Rankings. If I get an opportunity, I will try to recalculate this.
Please, please, please update the website. It is a fascinating subject but, if the data is erroneous, it becomes pointless.
Thank you,
Pete Tomlin
First Previous 2-4 of 4 Next Last Delete Replies
Reply
Recommend Delete Message 2 of 4 in Discussion
From: AsproFender Sent: 08/07/2004 14:19
Hi Pete
I've replied to you personally via email, but thought I'd clarify the position here for other site users.
Thanks for the kind words about the site, and well done for your hard work in the original involvement. Your original list was considered during the creation of the UFWC website, however, we decided to calculate the results in a slightly different way, for the following reason:
The South Korea 1-0 Colombia match on 31/01/95 is a contentious issue. Certainly the South Koreans did seem to field an under-21 side. However, according to FIFA's list of results, as featured on the FIFA.com website, this match WAS a FIFA 'A' match. That would make the opinion of the South Korean FA irrelevant as it is FIFA that decide the match status. UFWC rules state that all FIFA 'A' matches count, regardless of any other factors.
It seems the match was an 'A' match, but South Korea (or the Korean Republic) decided not to field a full side. Side often field weakened sides in friendlies (look at Sven's England!) but the matches remain 'A' matches. In June Nigeria lost the UFWC title to Angola in June after fielding a below-par side, and that was a World Cup Qualifier!
So, yes, I take the point, and certainly the subject remains open for discussion. But I would argue that the data is not erroneous, so I hope visitors will not find the site to be pointless!
Thanks for taking the time to discuss this. Football - contentious? Who'd have believed that!
Paul
Reply
Recommend Delete Message 3 of 4 in Discussion
From: FingersLily Sent: 22/07/2004 11:44
Hi AsproFender,
Thanks for taking the time to reply to me, both personally & on the message board.
I completely accept and agree with your response. At the time I conducted my research, the FIFA website did not seem to be able to decided whether or not the South Korea game was a full international & just referred people to the South Korean FA website which, of course, did not recognise the game as such.
However, as you state, FIFA now DO consider it a proper international so my original list is the erroneous one.
Please don't think I was suggesting this website is pointless. I actually think the opposite - it is an excellent website that is very well researched & presented. I was just saying that including an invalid match could render the title of 'Current Unofficial World Champion' pointless.
Of course, this is not the case & I am delighted that it isn't.
Thanks again,
Pete
Reply
Recommend Delete Message 4 of 4 in Discussion
From: AsproFender Sent: 26/07/2004 09:20
Hi Pete
Thanks for your message. I'm glad to have your backing over the South Korea match - it removes any lingering doubt.
Cheers
Paul
Hi Everyone,
I think this is an excellent website, very well-designed & laid out.
I was delighted, also, to see my name on the 'About' page. I do feel partly responsible for this, seeing as I was involved in the original discussions years ago on the Guardian website.
I do, however, have to point out that this website displays incorrect results. If you look back at my contribution all those years ago, you will see that I did not include the South Korea 1-0 Colombia match on 31/01/95.
I did some extensive research when compiling my list and I am in no doubt whatsoever that this was not an official match. It was more of an exhibition game with South Korea fielding a sort of Under 21 side (although it wasn't even officially that team).
The South Korean FA do not recognise it as an International & neither do FIFA. Consequently, no appearance/goal stats for this game exist. If you do not accept this, please take a look at the South Korean FA website for confirmation. If this game is included, we should also have testimonials, warm-up games & exhibition matches which would make a huge difference to the outcome.
As it turns out, excluding this match does not make a huge difference to the overall results list. I have attached a file showing the route that should be followed, starting with the match PRIOR to the unofficial game and ending with the 1998 World Cup match between Brazil & Holland, where the incorrect trail is re-joined.
Obviously, excluding this match will have an effect on the All-Time Rankings. If I get an opportunity, I will try to recalculate this.
Please, please, please update the website. It is a fascinating subject but, if the data is erroneous, it becomes pointless.
Thank you,
Pete Tomlin
First Previous 2-4 of 4 Next Last Delete Replies
Reply
Recommend Delete Message 2 of 4 in Discussion
From: AsproFender Sent: 08/07/2004 14:19
Hi Pete
I've replied to you personally via email, but thought I'd clarify the position here for other site users.
Thanks for the kind words about the site, and well done for your hard work in the original involvement. Your original list was considered during the creation of the UFWC website, however, we decided to calculate the results in a slightly different way, for the following reason:
The South Korea 1-0 Colombia match on 31/01/95 is a contentious issue. Certainly the South Koreans did seem to field an under-21 side. However, according to FIFA's list of results, as featured on the FIFA.com website, this match WAS a FIFA 'A' match. That would make the opinion of the South Korean FA irrelevant as it is FIFA that decide the match status. UFWC rules state that all FIFA 'A' matches count, regardless of any other factors.
It seems the match was an 'A' match, but South Korea (or the Korean Republic) decided not to field a full side. Side often field weakened sides in friendlies (look at Sven's England!) but the matches remain 'A' matches. In June Nigeria lost the UFWC title to Angola in June after fielding a below-par side, and that was a World Cup Qualifier!
So, yes, I take the point, and certainly the subject remains open for discussion. But I would argue that the data is not erroneous, so I hope visitors will not find the site to be pointless!
Thanks for taking the time to discuss this. Football - contentious? Who'd have believed that!
Paul
Reply
Recommend Delete Message 3 of 4 in Discussion
From: FingersLily Sent: 22/07/2004 11:44
Hi AsproFender,
Thanks for taking the time to reply to me, both personally & on the message board.
I completely accept and agree with your response. At the time I conducted my research, the FIFA website did not seem to be able to decided whether or not the South Korea game was a full international & just referred people to the South Korean FA website which, of course, did not recognise the game as such.
However, as you state, FIFA now DO consider it a proper international so my original list is the erroneous one.
Please don't think I was suggesting this website is pointless. I actually think the opposite - it is an excellent website that is very well researched & presented. I was just saying that including an invalid match could render the title of 'Current Unofficial World Champion' pointless.
Of course, this is not the case & I am delighted that it isn't.
Thanks again,
Pete
Reply
Recommend Delete Message 4 of 4 in Discussion
From: AsproFender Sent: 26/07/2004 09:20
Hi Pete
Thanks for your message. I'm glad to have your backing over the South Korea match - it removes any lingering doubt.
Cheers
Paul